Curse

eA-Zaku · Jun 12, 2005, 12:08 AM // 00:08

Or an ear.

Deagol · Jun 12, 2005, 11:52 AM // 11:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quantum_Cats

It's an online roleplaying game. It's massive (how many people play it

Around 50 in any particular instance. And each person play in his own world, quest he has solved affect how the world looks later for that particular person, but not for anyone else (except possibly if they are in a partry with him).

You are welcome to call Guild Wars a MMORPG, it is after all just a word, it can mean whatever you decide it should mean. But if you think of Guild Wars as "a MMORPG with no monthly fees", people will have the wrong expactations. Such as the possibility of random encounters, which is one property usually associated with MMORPG's.

ArenaNet is doing the smart thing, and inventing a new name for the game category Guild Wars belong to, namely CORPG. Unfortunately, because of its superficial similaritly with traditional MMROPG's, people keep thinking their experience with MMROPG's apply to Guild Wars.

The game industry have had so little renewal for years, that people can't recognize something new. And Guild Wars isn't really that new, it is a hybrid game borrowing from the established FPS, RTS, single player RPG and MMORPG genres.

Aaaaagh · Jun 12, 2005, 11:58 AM // 11:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quantum_Cats

Now we all know Guild Wars is an MMORPG. You just don't have to pay monthly for it.

No, its not. Since it is all instanced it does not fit under MMORPG, you can only play with a small group of people at any time. Cities dont really count, they are more like chat rooms. If GW is an mmorpg so is Starcraft.

Shadow_Avenger · Jun 12, 2005, 12:41 PM // 12:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaaaagh

No, its not. Since it is all instanced it does not fit under MMORPG, you can only play with a small group of people at any time. Cities dont really count, they are more like chat rooms. If GW is an mmorpg so is Starcraft.

Have to agree, In real MMORPG's you go off you explore and you bump into people in combat areas, you simply cannot play them like a single player game which GW can. Some use the same adventure area principles as GW, but this are mission based, and generally not exploration based. With MMORPG's you pick a server, you are stuck on that server with upto 2000 other players at any one time. Yes GW is Online only, yes it is massively multiplayer, and yes it RPG based, but even GW try to steer away from MMORPG as it simply isn't one, they prefer CORPG.

Quantum_Cats · Jun 12, 2005, 01:39 PM // 13:39

There's game-wide guild chat. There's city-wide local chat. You can whisper anybody who is online. You can trade with anybody. There is a huge world.

Just because it's all instanced doesn't mean it's not an MMOPRG. And just because it doesn't fit the EQ stereotype doesn't mean it's not an MMORPG.
If you only went to towns in WoW to find a group for the nearest instance, and only played the game by going to instances, it would still be an MMORPG.
GW, the point is to explore. In MMO's, the point is to explore. In MMO's, you're supposed to hit the level max, and then PvP. In GW, you hit the level max, beat the missions, and then PvP. C'mon. How can you even argue?

Quote:

Yes GW is Online only, yes it is massively multiplayer, and yes it RPG based, but even GW try to steer away from MMORPG as it simply isn't one, they prefer CORPG.

GW is just a different (better) take on MMORPGs. It fits all the requirements of being an MMO.

Quote:

The game industry have had so little renewal for years, that people can't recognize something new. And Guild Wars isn't really that new, it is a hybrid game borrowing from the established FPS, RTS, single player RPG and MMORPG genres.

It is something new. It's a new take on MMOs. I know I'm repeating myself, but think about it. Just because Super Mario 64 was in 3D for the first time, does that make it no longer an adventure game, or an innovation in the genre? I think it would be better for GW and better for MMORPGs in general to call it an MMORPG. Gives them a better name, imo.

Quote:

Cities dont really count, they are more like chat rooms.

PvP District cities would obviously be more than that. They would be arenas or combat+ areas. And towns at the same time.

john little · Jun 12, 2005, 04:03 PM // 16:03

It's a discussion that's been done to death but GW is more of an online RPG (of the console 'i save the world' sense) than a MMORPG ('i am a woodcutter who kills monsters in my spare time' sense).

I agree that there should be more varied styles of PvP, a last man standing with no monks allowed would be cool IMO, as would negative conditions environments like the dragon's lair mission, PvP missions where you are assigned random skills from your skillset, Battle Royale syle scenarios, where groups are added every couple of minutes. There are quite a few different team based events you could have, I'm hoping that it's one area that aNet will really pull out the stops in future expansions.

Shadow_Avenger · Jun 12, 2005, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Sorry Quantum Cats, but if GW is a really MMORPG, then so was Diablo, I could connect, chat to people using the chat rooms, and form a party and go kick back with said party in my own private online game.
The only thing that is more advanced about it, is that the chat room is a ingame town, rather than just text based chat room and that I can continue to use the chat ingame to speak to people outside my private game world.
MMORPG doesn't mean mega online chat with private game, they are not private games. Go play one, and you will see.
In any one district what is the most players allowed?? 100? 200? definately not 2000+ like real MMORPG's.
The MMORPG gendra isn't going to change due to GW, there if anything may be a few GW clones. Real MMORPG games will continue to charge monthly and always will, those that don't are either end of line products or drumming up new trade, Anarchy online is doing this atm, but if you actually want any newer content from expansions etc you have to pay monthly.

Bazooka · Jun 13, 2005, 01:53 PM // 13:53

No one can beat World of Warcraft's implementation of the Ganking System

Epinephrine · Jun 13, 2005, 04:02 PM // 16:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deagol

You are welcome to call Guild Wars a MMORPG, it is after all just a word, it can mean whatever you decide it should mean.

NO! This is the kind of liberal garbage that dilutes language. Words have meanings for a reason. I can't just call my car a cat, because the cat license is cheaper. You can't just "call something" what you want to call it if the words are to have any intrinsic meaning. I agree that MMORPG is poorly defined, but that is because it is a new concept, and I would argue that GW is in no way an MMORPG, any more than online chess is.

After all, there are online chess games in which players meet in lobbies (like GW districts), they are multiplayer, in that each game is more than one player, they are massive by some definitions, with 1000s of players on at a time, they are role-playing, in that you play the role of a king making tactical decisions about how to defend his territory and take the opposing king hostage using your army, and they are most definitely games. But they are not MMORPGS, and neither is GW.

A determining fator in an MMO would be the massive number of people sharing the world. There is no shared world in GW, you share a world with at most 7 people in PvE, and a few more in PvP. Hardly the "massive" numbers seen in other true MMOs. Lobbies aren't really the world, and towns are nothing more than large lobbies with a few neat ways to interact. Sure, they're cute and more graphical than D2 lobbies were, with a few more functions, but a merchant or two and the ability to emote at each other hardly makes it a shared world.

Perishiko ReLLiK · Jun 13, 2005, 05:58 PM // 17:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quantum_Cats

Online games that have mastered the PvP area have usually had random PvP encounters. In the wild. In the game. This is something that Guild Wars does not have. The only way to PvP is guild battles, HoH, and arenas.

Why not implement PvP districts?

Only one for every area. And even missions would be PvP+, anyone who entered a mission or otherwise instanced area from a PvP district would all be in the same instance (don't know what else to call it, I come from UO, DAoC, and WoW). Anyone would be freely attackable unless they were in your guild or party, and your guildmates/team-mates names would be a different color from everyone else.

Monsters would be on a respawn timer, and bosses would be too. Loot would be increased. You would be able to use a Scalping Kit on a corpse, and get that person's head as an item to decorate your guild hall with (Add a row of spikes that you can put heads on somewhere?). Or, you could hand the head in to a town Bounty Collector, to check if there is a bounty on the person, set by other people at the Bounty Collector, which would only be accessible in PvP districts. Vendors would also have a slightly lower price on items.

Allow a function for guild alliances, so you wouldn't accidentally attack an allied guild in a PvP+ area. Add a rank system, but don't let players directly access it. Show it by hueing people the way bosses are hued in PvP areas. The higher rank on someone, the more definite their "aura", and add a color scale to it as well.

Keep guild halls instanced the way they are.

This wouldn't be too late to fit in the list for the next expansion, would it?

Everything you just described there is nothing to do with guild wars... it sounds like you like the conventional mmorpg too much, and you should seriously just pay monthly if that's the sort of thing you want...

This is a guild wars world, and it's going to stay a guild wars world. You don't pay monthly, so when you get tired of the ganking/repetitive grind of sitting killing the same monster... you can just come back to guild wars, and play a going-to-be-perfect pvp game, and remember that you're not paying for it... perhaps even be amazed at why you play the other game... seeing how there is no enjoyment out of the others, nothing but paying for a place to sit and waste your life away...

johnnylange · Jun 13, 2005, 10:15 PM // 22:15

I'd like to know how did this thread go from dicussing PvP Districts to a arguement about monthly fees and MMO's?

Quantum_Cats · Jun 18, 2005, 10:07 PM // 22:07

Quote:

Everything you just described there is nothing to do with guild wars... it sounds like you like the conventional mmorpg too much, and you should seriously just pay monthly if that's the sort of thing you want..

I played the conventional MMORPGs. They are Everquest clones, and this is not. This is a new kind of game, and I think it would benefit from some of the other elements of MMORPGs. Not all of them, mind you, just a few. And to say that would make this game too much like an MMORPG, then so would having classes, armor dyes, a gold and platinum system, capes, guilds, and communication between people.

This is going to be a perfect PvP game. However, there is no RANDOM PvP, and for this to be a perfect PvP game, it needs random PvP. Not random teams, not random matches, someone attacking you when you are not exactly sure what to expect.